>> THE FOLLOWING PROGRAM IS A PBS WISCONSIN ORIGINAL PRODUCTION.

>> WISCONSIN CLERKS PREPARE FOR THE SPRING ELECTION TUESDAY IN THE MIDST OF COURT RULES PROVIDING SHIFTING INSTRUCTIONS AND WISCONSINITES CONTINUE TO TURN OUT SUPPORT FOR UKRAINE.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

TONIGHT ON "HERE AND NOW," CANDIDATES MAKE THEIR FINAL APPEALS TO VOTERS TO BE MILWAUKEE'S NEXT MAYOR.

WHAT IS NEXT FOR WISCONSIN REDISTRICTING?

AND AD CAMPAIGN CALLS UPON VOTERS TO HAVE TRUST IN THEIR LOCAL ELECTION CLERKS.

IT'S "HERE AND NOW" FOR APRIL 1ST.

>> FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.

>> FOR THE FIRST TIME IN NEARLY 20 YEARS WISCONSIN'S LARGEST CITY WILL VOTE FOR A NEW MAYOR WITH JUST FOUR DAYS BEFORE THE SPECIAL ELECTION IN MILWAUKEE, CANDIDATES CAVALIER JOHNSON, THE CURRENT ACTING MAYOR AND FORMER CITY COUNCIL PRESIDENT AND ROBERT DONOVAN, FORMER CITY COUNCIL ALDERMAN SAT DOWN FOR A CONVERSATION WITH OUR PARTNERS AT MILWAUKEE PBS.

>> HOW MUCH OF THE UPTICK IN VIOLENCE HAS BEEN IMPACTED BY THE PANDEMIC AND VOTERS WANT SPECIFICS AS TO YOUR PLANS FOR THE CITY TO MINIMIZE ALL OF THIS CRIME AND VIOLENCE.

CANDIDATES DONOVAN.

>> I WILL SAY THIS, I THINK PERHAPS SOME OF IT IS DUE TO COVID OR THIS WHOLE PERIOD OF THE LAST TWO YEARS WE HAVE SEEN CHAOS REIGN IN MILWAUKEE AND I SIMPLY DO NOT BELIEVE THAT THERE IS ANY HOPE OF RESTORING ORDER AND STABILITY TO OUR STREETS AND NEIGHBORHOODS WITHOUT PROVIDING THE MILWAUKEE POLICE DEPARTMENT WITH THE APPROPRIATE LEVEL OF MAN POWER.

IN ADDITION, WE NEED TO ENSURE THAT OUR DISTRICT ATTORNEYS AND OUR JUDGES ARE HOLDING OUR CRIMINALS ACCOUNTABLE FOR THEIR CRIMES.

IT SEEMS TO ME EVERY TIME WE HEAR OF SOME HORRENDOUS CRIME BEING COMMITTED IT'S PERPETRATED BY AN INDIVIDUAL, A RECORD A MILE LONG, SHOULD NOT HAVE EVEN BEEN OUT ON THE STREET IN THE FIRST PLACE.

SO THOSE ARE CRITICAL COMPONENTS TO BEGIN THE PROCESS OF RESTORING ORDER TO OUR COMMUNITY.

>> CANDIDATE JOHNSON?

>> YEAH, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT AND COVID CERTAINLY HAS PLAYED A ROLE IN THE UPTICK IN CRIME AND VIOLENCE WE HAVE SEEN IN LARGE CITIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY.

MILWAUKEE IS NO EXCEPTION.

AND WE NEED TO HAVE HOLISTIC PUBLIC SAFETY IN ORDER TO ADDRESS THE PROBLEMS WE HAVE ON THE STREETS OF MILWAUKEE.

SO HOLISTIC PUBLIC SAFETY MEANS HAVING THE ADEQUATE NUMBER OF POLICE OFFICERS, SOMETHING THAT I WANT TO SEE AND SOMETHING THAT I'VE BEEN FIGHTING FOR.

IT ALSO MEANS WORKING TO HAVE MENTAL HEALTH SERVICES THAT ARE AVAILABLE TO FOLKS IN OUR COMMUNITY.

IT ALSO MAKES -- ALSO LOOKS TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE EARLIER INTERVENTIONS IN THE LIVES OF YOUNG PEOPLE, AND WE HAVE HAD CONVERSATIONS WITH THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY, WITH THE CHIEF JUDGE FOR MILWAUKEE COUNTY.

THAT HAS HAD THE STATE COME IN TO MAKE AN INVESTMENT, TENS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN OUR PUBLIC SAFETY APPARATUS HERE IN MILWAUKEE.

>> SHOULD OFFICERS BE RETURNED TO SCHOOLS?

>> I DON'T BELIEVE THAT POLICE NECESSARILY NEED TO BE INSIDE THE CLASSROOM.

I'VE NOT CALLED FOR THAT.

WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE, THOUGH, IS THAT POLICE ARE ABLE TO BE ON HAND AT SCHOOLS, ESPECIALLY AFTER SCHOOL WHEN THINGS ARE MORE LIKELY TO HAPPEN, MORE LIKELY TO POP UP.

>> WE JUST CAN'T HAVE OUR POLICE COMING AFTER THE FACT.

WE NEED OFFICERS, THE APPROPRIATE OFFICERS IN OUR SCHOOLS CONNECTING WITH STUDENTS, CREATING THOSE RELATIONSHIPS THAT ARE SO CRITICAL SO THAT THEY CAN PREVENT CRIME OR PREVENT THE FIGHT OR THE DISTURBANCE FROM OCCURRING.

>> LAST YEAR THE OFFICE OF EQUITY AND INCLUSION FOUND THE PANDEMIC HAD IMMENSE AND WIDESPREAD IMPACTS ON THE MILWAUKEE WORKERS, LOW WAGE WORKERS HAD IT PARTICULARLY HARD, BLACK NEIGHBORHOODS HAD DISPROPORTIONATE UNEMPLOYMENT IMPACTS.

WHAT SPECIFIC STEPS WILL YOU TAKE TO BRING JOBS TO CHALLENGE NEIGHBORHOODS AND ENSURE THAT THEY PAY A LIVING WAGE?

>> RIGHT NOW DOWNTOWN THERE IS A SKY RISE COMING OUT OF THE GROUND, TALLEST IN WISCONSIN, AND SKYLINE DEFINING AND GREAT FOR DOWNTOWN.

THE THING THAT'S MOST EXCITING IS THE FACT IT WILL TAKE A MILLION CONSTRUCTION HOURS AND 40% OF THOSE HOURS, 400,000 WILL GO TO PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THE MOST DEPRESSED NEIGHBORHOODS IN MILWAUKEE.

NEIGHBORHOODS I GREW UP IN BECAUSE OF THE CITY'S RESIDENCE PREFERENCE PROGRAM, SO CREATE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THOSE IN DISADVANTAGED CHALLENGED NEIGHBORHOODS TO HAVE AN ACCESS POINT TO A 21st CENTURY JOBS.

WE NEED FOLKS TO HAVE THE ACCESS POINTS.

>> I WOULD WANT AS MAYOR DEPARTMENT OF CITY DEVELOPMENT THAT IS FAR MORE AGGRESSIVE IN REACHING OUTSIDE OUR REGION TO ATTRACT BUSINESSES TO COME TO MILWAUKEE AND I WOULD URGE THAT DEPARTMENT AND INSIST THAT THAT DEPARTMENT WORK WITH MANY OF OUR EXECUTIVES CURRENTLY HERE IN MILWAUKEE.

MILWAUKEE IS HOME TO SOME OF THE BEST FORTUNE 500 COMPANIES IN THE COUNTRY.

WE NEED TO TAP INTO THE CONNECTIONS THAT THOSE C.E.O.s HAVE WITH OTHER C.E.O.s AROUND THE COUNTRY AND BRING SOME OF THEIR VENDORS AND SOME OF THEIR COMPANIES THAT THEY ARE CONNECTED WITH RIGHT HERE IN MILWAUKEE, BUT IN ADDITION, AS I HAVE AN SAID PREVIOUSLY, WE NEED TO TAKE PROGRAMS THAT WORK IN OTHER COMMUNITIES AND IMPLEMENT THEM HERE IN MILWAUKEE.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WOULD INSIST ON MOVING FORWARD WITH AS MAYOR IS THE CLEVELAND CO-OP MODEL THAT HAS BEEN VERY SUCCESSFUL IN CLEVELAND IN TAKING INDIVIDUALS WHO HAVE CHRONICALLY UNEMPLOYED OR LOW SKILLED, TRAINING THEM, GETTING THEM INTO JOBS AND THOSE INDIVIDUALS THEN BECOME OWNERS, CO-OWNERS OF THE COMPANY THEY ARE WORKING WITH.

>> BOTH OF YOU HAVE BEEN FAIRLY CRITICAL OF OUR FORMER MAYOR ABOUT HIS SEEMING LACK OF WORK IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS.

CANDIDATE JOHNSON YOU SAID IN A RECENT DEBATE, 20 YEARS UNDER TOM BARRETT, DEPRESSED NEIGHBORHOOD YOU GREW UP IN, WINDOWS BUSTED OUT, DOORS BOARDED UP, HAVE NOT SEEN IMPROVEMENT.

YOU SAID WE HAVE TO LIFT THE NEIGHBORHOODS AND CREATE STABILITY.

WHAT CONCRETE STEPS WOULD YOU DO TO IMPROVE UNDERSERVED COMMUNITIES.

>> I WANT TO SEE US TO GET BACK TO A POINT IN THE COMMUNITY WHERE WE ARE PROVIDING FAMILY-SUPPORTING JOB OPPORTUNITIES FOR THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE HERE.

WORKING WITH ENTREPRENEURS, MAKING SURE THEY HAVE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE ACCESS TO RESOURCES TO START NEW JOBS, WORKING WITH OUR DEPARTMENT OF CITY DEVELOPMENT, WORKING WITH M7 TO ATTRACT NEW BUSINESSES TO MILWAUKEE TO LURE HERE, LIKE MILWAUKEE TOOL.

>> EMPHASIZING, RESTORING SAFETY TO OUR NEIGHBORHOODS AND THEN BEGIN THE PROCESS ONCE THAT'S ACCOMPLISHED OF BUSINESSES WILL WANT TO COME IN TO NEIGHBORHOODS.

WE ALSO DESPERATELY NEED TO ENSURE THAT THESE HOUSES THAT ARE BURNT UP, FIRE DAMAGE OR BOARDED UP, WE EITHER TEAR THEM DOWN OR RESTORE THEM, ONE OR THE OTHER.

WE NEED THE RESOURCES TO GET THAT DONE.

BUT WE BEGIN THE PROCESS ONE AT A TIME OF TAKING OUR NEIGHBORHOODS AND REVITALIZING THEM.

>> THE STATE SUPREME COURT TODAY DENIED A GOVERNOR TONY EVERS' MOTION WHY HIS REDISTRICTING MOTION TO BE UPHELD.

THE U.S. SUPREME COURT STRUCK DOWN THE MAPS AND SENT THE CASE BACK TO THE STATE.

EXPERT ON ELECTION AND CONSTITUTIONAL LAW AND FORMER CLERK FOR TWO U.S. SUPREME COURT JUSTICES, U.W.

MADISON LAW SCHOOL PROFESSOR ROBERT YABLON JOINS US WITH THE LATEST.

THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> GOOD TO BE WITH YOU.

>> THE EVERS MOTION AND EXPERT REPORT SAID THE SEVEN ASSEMBLY DISTRICTS IN HIS MAP AVOID ILLEGAL VOTE DILUTION UNDER THE VOTING RIGHTS ACTS, BUT REPUBLICANS CALLED IT AMONG OTHER THINGS UNSOLICITED AND THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT APPARENTLY AGREED TODAY, REJECTING THE EXPERT'S SUBMISSION.

WASN'T SCOTUS ASKING FOR MORE EVIDENCE IN SUPPORT OR JUST NOT FROM EVERS?

>> WELL, THE U.S. SUPREME COURT INDICATED THAT ONE OF THE OPTIONS AVAILABLE TO THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT WAS TO CONSIDER MORE EVIDENCE AND SO I THINK THAT IT WAS THAT LINE IN THEIR OPINION THAT LED THE GOVERNOR TO PUT IN THIS SUBMISSION TODAY, WHICH THE SUPREME COURT, WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT DENIED IN A ONE-LINE ORDER.

SO IT SEEMS THEY HAVE DECIDED THEY ARE NOT GOING TO TAKE NEW EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE, INSTEAD THERE ARE A COUPLE OF OTHER PATHS THEY MAY TRY TO PURSUE TO GET A LEGAL MAP IN PLACE.

>> LIKE?

>> WELL, SO ESSENTIALLY THEY WERE GIVEN EARLIER IN THIS LITIGATION A NUMBER OF PROPOSALS FROM THE PARTIES, THEY CHOSE THE GOVERNOR'S MAP, THEY SAID IT BEST COMPLIED WITH THE LEAST CHANGE FRAMEWORK THEY IMPOSED, SO GO BACK TO OTHER PROPOSALS AND SEE WHICH IS THE NEXT BEST AND ADOPT ONE OF THOSE.

THAT'S WHAT THE LEGISLATURE IS ASKING FOR.

AND THAT WOULD MEAN JETTISONING THE GOVERNOR'S MAP WHOLESALE AND ADOPTING THEIRS INSTEAD.

THE GOVERNOR THINKS IT'S OVERKILL.

THE SUPREME COURT ONLY CALLED IN COURT THE MILWAUKEE AREA, SO THE GOVERNOR SAID EITHER HEAR MORE EVIDENCE, THAT'S WHAT THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT SAID TODAY IT'S NOT GOING TO DO OR LOOK AT THE EVIDENCE IN THE RECORD NOW AND MAKE A MORE CONVINCING CASE TO THE U.S. SUPREME COURT WHY YOU NEED TO CONTINUE TO UPHOLD THE GOVERNOR'S MAP.

SEEMS LIKE RIGHT NOW EITHER THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT IS GOING TO GET MORE ELABORATE REASONS WHY THE GOVERNOR'S MAP INDEED COMPLIES WITH THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT OR CHOOSE ONE OF THE OTHER MAPS SUBMITTED EARLIER IN THE CASE.

>> IS THIS LIKE A ROCKET DOCKET IN THE STATE HIGH COURT, SHOULD WE EXPECT A DECISION ON WISCONSIN MAPS VERY SOON?

>> WE WILL SEE A DECISION SOON.

THE COURT IS -- THEY REALIZE THEY NEED TO GET ON THIS EXPEDITIOUSLY.

THE NOMINATION PETITION PROCESS FOR THE FALL ELECTIONS OPENS ON APRIL 15TH AND THE WISCONSIN ELECTIONS COMMISSION NEEDS SOME TIME AHEAD OF THAT TO DO SOME I AM -- IMPLEMENTATION STEPS, AND MAKE SURE CANDIDATES KNOW WHAT DISTRICT THEY ARE IN, AND THE VOTERS KNOW WHAT DISTRICT THEY ARE IN.

WE WILL SEE A DECISION SOON FROM THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT.

>> BACKING UP A BIT, WHAT IS THE POINT OF A MAJORITY-MINORITY DISTRICT UNDER THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT?

>> IT'S A LANDMARK FEDERAL LAW THAT SEEKS TO ENSURE FAIR REPRESENTATION FOR COMMUNITIES OF COLOR.

AND YOU ARE PRIMARILY TALKING ABOUT COMMUNITIES OF COLOR THAT WOULD POTENTIALLY BE LARGE ENOUGH TO FORM A MAJORITY IN A SINGLE MEMBER DISTRICT, AND IN WISCONSIN THE ACT PRIMARILY APPLIES IN THE MILWAUKEE AREA WHERE YOU HAVE LARGE ENOUGH AFRICAN AMERICAN COMMUNITIES THAT THEY COULD FORM ELECTORAL MAJORITIES AT THE DISTRICT LEVEL.

TRADITIONALLY WHEN YOU HAVE COMMUNITIES THAT LARGE, POLITICALLY COHESIVE COMMUNITIES, AND THEY VOTE DISTINCTLY FROM OTHER COMMUNITIES, YOU TEND TO ENSURE THAT THEY WILL GET REPRESENTATION, AND THAT'S WHY THE GOVERNOR THROUGH THE SEVENTH DISTRICT IN MILWAUKEE, SAW THE AFRICAN AMERICAN COMMUNITY IN MILWAUKEE HAD GROWN TO SOME EXTENT, PARTICULARLY RELATIVE TO OTHER COMMUNITIES AND THOUGHT THE ACT REQUIRED THE ADDITION OF THAT DISTRICT.

THE U.S. SUPREME COURT WAS UNCONVINCED AND THAT'S WHY THEY REVERSED THE DECISION AND NOW HAVE SENT IT BACK.

>> IN YOUR EXPERT OPINION, HOW WELL DO EITHER OF THE MAPS, LEGISLATURE'S OR THE GOVERNOR'S ENSURE THEY HAVE THE POWER TO ELECT CANDIDATES OF THEIR CHOICE?

>> THIS IS A REALLY COMPLICATED AREA OF THE LAW.

THE SUPREME COURT JUSTICES THEMSELVES SOMETIMES LAMENT HOW COMPLICATED AND CONFUSING IT CAN BE.

SO YOU KNOW, ONE -- WITH THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT IS NOT ABOUT IS PURELY CREATING DISTRICTS WITH A NUMERICAL MAJORITY OF A MINORITY POPULATION.

BECAUSE SOMETIMES THAT WON'T BE ENOUGH FOR THEM TO ELECT A PREFERRED CANDIDATE, GIVEN VOTING PATTERNS AND SO ON.

SO IF YOU ARE DOING A FUNCTIONAL ANALYSIS WHAT YOU MIGHT SEE IS HAVING THE MAJORITY-MINORITY DISTRICT MAY BE INADEQUATE.

OTHER CASES, YOU DON'T NEED TO CREATE A MAJORITY-MINORITY DISTRICT AT ALL, MAYBE CROSSOVER FROM OTHER COMMUNITIES TO ALLOW THE PREFERRED REPRESENTATIVE.

SO REQUIRES A DETAILED FUNCTIONAL ANALYSIS AND ONE OF THE COMPLAINTS FROM THE U.S. SUPREME COURT, THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT DID NOT DELVE DEEPLY ENOUGH INTO THE KIND OF FUNCTIONAL INQUIRY.

>> LESS THAN A MINUTE LEFT, HOW ABOUT HOW THE U.S. SUPREME COURT HANDLED IT.

DESCRIBED AS SHOCKING AND UNPRECEDENTED.

WHY?

>> WELL, THE DISSENT DID DESCRIBE IT AS UNPRECEDENTED AND A COUPLE OF UNUSUAL FEATURES.

FIRST OF ALL, SUMMARY REVERSAL.

THE U.S. SUPREME COURT ACTED QUICKLY, IT DID NOT HEAR FULL BRIEFING OR ORAL ARGUMENT AND DOES NOT DO THAT VERY OFTEN, AND WHEN IT DOES, THERE IS A CRYSTAL CLEARER ROR.

BUT THEY POINTED OUT NUANCES HAD BEEN OVERLOOKED BY THE MAJORITY.

SO, UNUSUAL IT WAS A SUMMARY REVERSAL, MORE THAN THAT, THAT IT HAPPENED SO CLOSE IN TIME TO WHEN THE STATE REALLY NEEDS TO HAVE MAPS.

THIS WAS A DISRUPTIVE FROM THE SUPREME COURT, AND THE U.S. SUPREME COURT SAID WE RECOGNIZE IT'S DIFFICULT TO RUN AN ELECTION AND WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT STATES ARE NOT -- THAT WRENCHES ARE NOT THROWN INTO STATE PROCESSES AT THE LAST MINUTE, BUT ESSENTIALLY WHAT THE SUPREME COURT DID TO WISCONSIN HERE.

>> HERE WE ARE.

PROFESSOR, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> GOOD TALKING TO YOU.

>> ELECTION CLERKS ACROSS WISCONSIN ARE GEARING UP DESPITE CURRENT UNCERTAINTY OVER LEGISLATIVE DISTRICT BOUNDARIES.

AND THEY HAVE TAKEN TO THE AIRWAVES WITH AN AD CAMPAIGN FEATURING LOCAL ELECTION CLERKS TO IMPRESS UPON STATE VOTERS THEY CAN TRUST HOW ELECTIONS ARE RUN IN THE STATE.

>> YOUR FRIEND IS AN ELECTION OFFICIAL.

>> YOUR FAMILY MEMBER IS A POLL WORKER.

>> WE TRUST OUR LOCAL ELECTIONS BECAUSE OUR FRIENDS, FAMILIES, AND NEIGHBORS RUN THEM.

>> WE TRUST OUR ELECTIONS BECAUSE WE TRUST THEM.

>> LOCAL GOVERNMENT ASSOCIATIONS PARTNERED TO CREATE THE AD FOLLOWING TWO YEARS OF DISTRUST IN THE ELECTORAL PROCESS BUT UNFOUNDED ALLEGATIONS OF WIDESPREAD FRAUD.

THE LEAGUE OF WISCONSIN MUNICIPALITIES SPONSORED THE SPOT WHOSE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR IS JERRY DESCHANE, HE JOINS US NOW.

THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

>> THANK YOU FOR INVITING ME, HAPPY TO BE HERE.

>> WHY DID YOU FEEL IT WAS NEEDED TO AIR ADS FEATURING LOCAL CLERKS TO INSTILL TRUST IN OUR ELECTIONS?

>> WELL, FREDERICA, TWO FUNDAMENTAL REASONS.

THE FIRST ONE IS PEOPLE ARE -- A LOT OF QUESTIONS ARE BEING RAISED ABOUT ELECTIONS, AND PEOPLE'S FAITH IS BEING SHAKEN, IF YOU WILL.

AND WE WANTED TO START FROM THE REMINDER OF HEY, FOLKS, YOU CAN TRUST ELECTIONS, PRIMARILY BECAUSE YOU KNOW WHO IS RUNNING THEM.

FOR THE MOST PART, THESE ARE PEOPLE THAT YOU RECOGNIZE, YOU HAVE SEEN IN THE GROCERY STORE, SO WE WANTED TO START WITH THAT MESSAGE THAT HEY, LOOK, YOU KNOW THESE PEOPLE, YOU KNOW YOU CAN TRUST THESE PEOPLE.

THEY ARE YOUR NEIGHBORS.

THE SECOND REASON TO BE PERFECTLY SELFISH ABOUT IT IS CLERKS ARE UNDER A LOT OF PRESSURE AND IN THIS JOB MARKET THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS THEY COULD DO THAT DON'T COME WITH THE SAME PRESSURES AS THIS, SO WE WANTED TO GIVE THEM AN ATTA BOY, AND SAY WE KNOW YOU ARE DOING A GOOD JOB, KEEP IT UP.

>> WHAT ARE EXAMPLES CLERKS HAVE BEEN FACING AFTER THE PUBLIC AFTER THE HIGH PROFILE INVESTIGATIONS AFTER THE 2020 ELECTION FOR THE LAST TWO YEARS?

>> WELL, WE HAVE ALL SEEN NEWS ACCOUNTS.

THERE HAVE BEEN SOME DEATH THREATS.

ON A MORE DAY-TO-DAY BASIS, WE HEAR FROM CLERKS ALL OVER THE STATE WHO ARE GETTING ALL SORTS OF ACCUSATIONS THROWN AT THEM AT THE LOCAL LEVEL THAT FRANKLY THEY NEVER SAW COMING, FROM PEOPLE THAT THEY KNOW.

AND WHAT WE WANT TO SAY TO PEOPLE, IT'S OK TO HAVE QUESTIONS, BUT THE BEST SOURCE OF INFORMATION IS THAT CLERK, GO AND TALK TO HIM, GOOD AND TALK TO HER, AND GET YOUR OWN CONCERNS RESOLVED AT THE LOCAL LEVEL AND IF MORE PEOPLE WOULD DO THAT, FEWER QUESTIONS OUT THERE.

>> ON TOP OF THAT, WHAT KIND OF PRESSURES ARE CLERKS FACING WHEN COURTS MAKE LAST-MINUTE CHANGES TO THINGS LIKE DROP BOXES, ABSENTEE BALLOTS AND DISTRICT BOUNDARIES?

>> I DON'T THINK ANYTHING WILL BE QUITE AS CRAZY AS THE PANDEMIC WAS, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, REINVENT AN ELECTION ON, WHAT WAS THAT, ABOUT FOUR WEEKS' NOTICE.

BUT NONETHELESS.

LAST-MINUTE CHANGES ARE PROBABLY THE WORST THING YOU WANT DO BECAUSE THE CLERK HAS TO TRAIN POLL WORKERS, THEY HAVE TO BE CERTIFIED, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO BE SURE OF THE LAW, WHICH IS NOT ALL THAT BLACK AND WHITE THESE DAYS.

SO WE ASK LEGISLATORS, WE ASK A LOT OF POLICY MAKERS, GO AHEAD AND DEBATE THE ISSUES, WE THINK IT'S FUNDAMENTALLY HEALTHY, BUT TRY TO TIME IT SO YOU ARE NOT DOING IT RIGHT UP AGAINST AN ELECTION BECAUSE FRANKLY IT CAN BE CHAOTIC AND AS YOU KNOW, WHEN THE PUBLIC IS CONFUSED, THERE'S A LAST-MINUTE CHANGE, THAT IN ITSELF WILL BE DISTRUST.

>> ARE THE NUMBER OF LOCAL ELECTION WORKERS WANING IN THE MIDST OF ALL OF THIS?

>> THE NUMBERS ARE NOT WANING BECAUSE -- WELL, WE NEED TO HAVE AT LEAST 1832 OF THEM.

THAT'S HOW MANY TOWNS, VILLAGES AND CITIES THERE ARE IN WISCONSIN.

EVERY ONE OF THEM HAS TO HAVE AN ELECTION CLERK WHO IS TRAINED AND CERTIFIED.

WHAT IS HAPPENING IS THE GREAT RETIREMENT.

CLERKS ARE WALKING.

I CAN'T QUANTIFY FOR YOU WITH STATISTICS BUT ANECDOTALLY, WE ARE GETTING MORE THAN A FEW CLERKS SAYING I DON'T NEED THESE HEADACHES, AND YOU KNOW, THERE WILL BE NEW PEOPLE COMING IN, THAT'S GREAT, BUT WE ARE LOSING A LOT OF INSTITUTIONAL KNOWLEDGE, AND THAT'S A CONCERN, TOO.

>> ALL RIGHT.

JERRY DESCHANE, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US AND TALKING WITH US ABOUT THIS.

>> HAPPY TO TALK ABOUT IT.

THANK YOU.

>> A DANE COUNTY JUDGE HAS FOUND ASSEMBLY SPEAKER ROBIN VOS IN CONTEMPT FOR NOT TURNING OVER DOCUMENTS REQUESTED THROUGH OPEN DOCUMENTS LAWS.

ORDERED VOS AND THE STATE ASSEMBLY TO TURN THEM OVER IN TWO WEEKS AND TO PAY A DAILY FINE UNTIL THEY DO SO.

RELATING INTO AN INVESTIGATION BY THE 2020 INVESTIGATION LAUNCHED BY THE SPEAKER AND SUPREME COURT JUSTICE MICHAEL GABLEMAN.

OTHER NEWS, LOCAL EFFORTS TO HELP IN THE CRISIS HALF A WORLD AWAY CONTINUE AS WISCONSINITES FIND WAYS TO SUPPORT UKRAINE.

ONE SUCH EFFORT CALLED "WISCONSIN UKRAINIANS" OUT OF GREEN BAY IS RAISING FUNDS AND AWARENESS, GATHERING RESOURCES AND STORIES.

THE GROUP'S FOUNDER, JONATHAN PYLYPIV JOINS US NOW.

THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE.

>> GOOD MORNING, THANKS FOR GIVING US THE OPPORTUNITY TO HELP SHARE THE MESSAGE AND WHAT WE ARE DOING AS AN ORGANIZATION, THANK YOU.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

AS A NATIVE OF UKRAINE, WHEN YOU LOOK UPON WHAT IS HAPPENING THERE, YOU HAVE SAID THESE ARE OUR FRIENDS, OUR FAMILIES, AND OUR ANCESTORS.

HOW EMOTIONAL IS IT FOR YOU?

>> BOY, I MEAN, IT'S ALL VERY RAW WHEN YOU HEAR OF SOME OF THESE CITIES NOW THAT ARE BEING LIBERATED AND THE WAR CRIMES, THE ATROCITIES BEING DONE BY THE RUSSIAN INVADERS, IT'S JUST -- NOT ONLY LIKE HEARTBREAKING BUT ALSO JUST ENRAGING BECAUSE LIKE UKRAINIAN PEOPLE WANT TO BE IN PEACE AND OUR ANCESTORS, I THINK OF MY GRANDMA AND LETTING THEIR BODIES REST IN PEACE AND SO YOU KNOW, IT MOTIVATES US ALSO TO DO WHATEVER WE CAN IN WISCONSIN AND REALLY ALL OVER THE COUNTRY TO GALVANIZE THE SUPPORT LOCALLY WITHIN OUR COMMUNITIES, TO HELP BRING POSITIVE CHANGE OF SUPPORT BUT ALSO HELPING TELL THE STORY SO PEOPLE HEAR THE UKRAINIAN VOICE AND A DIRECT CONNECTION TO WHAT IS HAPPENING IN UKRAINE.

>> TELL US WHAT YOUR GROUP IS DOING.

I SEE THAT YOU ARE SITTING BEFORE A STORAGE ROOM OF GOODS.

TELL US WHAT UKRAINIANS IN WISCONSIN IS DOING.

>> YES, SO, WISCONSIN UKRAINIANS STARTED AS A Facebook PAGE IN 2014, BUT NOW WE ARE A 501C3 PENDING ORGANIZATION AND WE HAVE BOARD MEMBERS AND PEOPLE ALL OVER THE CITY.

I HAPPEN TO BE IN THE FOX CITIES AND A LOT OF US ARE IN THE GREEN BAY AREA, COLLECTING MUCH NEEDED ITEMS, WORKING WITH TRUSTED PARTNERS IN UKRAINE TO HELP LOGISTICS, TO GET ITEMS FROM POINT A TO POINT B, AND THE ITEMS YOU SEE BEHIND, THIS IS AT ST. MATTHEW'S CHURCH, ONE OF MANY DRIVES WE HAVE BEEN DOING AND IT'S KIND OF AN ONGOING EFFORT, AND ALSO FUNDRAISING, SO WE CAN BUY SOME HIGH IMPACT ITEMS.

WE ARE GETTING READY TO DONATE FUNDS SO A LOCAL NON-PROFIT IN UKRAINE CAN BUY A VAN TO NOT ONLY TRANSPORT REFUGEES BUT ALSO GOODS AND SUPPLIES MUCH NEEDED LIKE MEDICINE AND OTHER ITEMS LIKE THAT.

>> HOW HARD IS IT TO GET THOSE DONATIONS TO THE PEOPLE IN UKRAINE?

>> WHEN WE FIRST STARTED, A GRASSROOTS EFFORT, A LOT OF US FROM ALL OVER THE STATE JOINED FORCES TO DO MORE TOGETHER.

THIS MORNING I WAS HELPING A FRIEND WITH AN ART INSTALLATION, I SAW THE CURRENT OF THE RIVER HOW STRONG IT WAS, AND REFLECTING ON IT THAT ALL OF US IF WE MOVE TOGETHER AND WORK TOWARDS THE COMMON GOALS OF HELPING THE UKRAINIAN PEOPLE WE WILL BE STRONG AND POWERFUL TOGETHER AND I THINK GETTING THE ITEMS TO UKRAINE WE HAVE MULTIPLE WAYS.

ONE IS BY WORKING WITH TRUSTED PARTNERS LIKE HELP HEROES UKRAINE, IN CHICAGO, AND LOCAL TRUSTED PARTNERS IN UKRAINE AND POLAND.

WE ALREADY HAVE TRUST RELATIONS WITH SO SEND SOME FUNDS FOR PEOPLE WE KNOW AND TRUST AND THEY CAN PURCHASE SOME ITEMS LOCALLY IN MANY INSTANCES AND THEN GET THEM TO THE PEOPLE REALLY QUICK, LIKE WE DID WITH GENERATORS, GETTING THEM TO POLAND AND THEN UKRAINE TO THE MOST IMPACTFUL AREAS THAT NEEDED GENERATORS.

>> YOU AND OTHERS ARE IN CONSTANT COMMUNICATION WITH PEOPLE IN UKRAINE.

WHAT DO THE PEOPLE THERE THINK WILL HAPPEN?

>> YEAH, SO YOU KNOW, EVEN WHEN THIS WAR -- THE INVASION STARTED, I THINK THERE WAS A LOT OF CONCERN THAT RUSSIA WILL KEEP PUSHING AND YOU KNOW, TYPICALLY IN THE LAST EIGHT PLUS YEARS AND IN HISTORICALLY WE HAVE NOT SEEN A LOT OF THE RUSSIAN LEADERSHIP HONOR THEIR WORD, WHETHER IT'S THE BUDAPEST MEMORANDUM WHEN UKRAINE GAVE UP NUCLEAR WEAPONS, WHETHER IT'S 1932 AND 1933, MILLIONS OF UKRAINIANS WERE KILLED AND STARVED, SO VIEWING IT AS ANOTHER GENOCIDE OF THE UKRAINIAN PEOPLE.

THEY ARE KILLING CIVILIANS, TARGETING CHILDREN, WOMEN, THEY ARE NOT LETTING PEOPLE FLEE TO SAFETY AND THEY ARE CUTTING OFF FOOD AND WATER.

BASIC NEEDS.

AND SO WE ARE -- AND THEN SOME OF THESE AREAS ARE BEING RETAIN BY THE UKRAINIANS, HORRIBLE ATROCITIES.

SOME OF THE RUSSIAN TERRORISTS ARE DEFICATING ON THE CORPSES OF UKRAINIAN PEOPLE.

HOW LOW AND DEPRIVED THIS INVASION IS.

SO, WE ARE NOT ONLY FRUSTRATED AND UPSET, BUT WILL EXPOSE THE TRUTH THAT'S HAPPENING.

>> THANK YOU, THANK YOU FOR YOUR WORK.

JONATHAN PYLYPIV.

>> THANK YOU FOR YOUR SUPPORT OF WISCONSIN UKRAINIANS, APPRECIATE IT.

>> F.D.A.

AND C.D.C.

APPROVED SECOND MODERNA COVID-19 BOOSTERS FOR PEOPLE OVER 50 AND THE STATE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH SERVICES SUPPORTS GETTING THEM.

BUT FEDERAL AMERICAN RESCUE PLAN FUNDS RUN OUT, TESTING AND VACCINES MAY NO LONGER BE FREE ACCORDING TO MILWAUKEE PUBLIC HEALTH COMMISSIONER KIRSTEN JOHNSON.

>> NOW IS THE TIME TO GET VACCINATED.

AS FUNDING SOURCES ARE REEVALUATED, IT'S UNCLEAR HOW LONG THE SERVICES WILL REMAIN FREE.

IF YOU HAVE BEEN PUTTING OFF GETTING THE VACCINE, MAKE THE PLAN TODAY FOR THE VACCINE AND BOOSTER.

>> FOR MORE ON THIS AND OTHER ISSUES FACING WISCONSIN, WISCONSINPBS.ORG AND THEN CLICK ON THE NEWS TAB.

THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT.

I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.

HAVE A GOOD WEEKEND.

♪ FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS WISCONSIN.