It's.

From our state house studio in Montgomery.

I'm Todd Stacey, welcome to Capitol Journal.

It has been a wild week here in the capital city and here at the state House, where we've been covering a special session of the Alabama Legislature to address congressional and state Senate district maps.

Governor Kay Ivey called lawmakers back to Montgomer this week to address those maps, after the U.S.

Supreme Court ruled last Wednesday that a majority black congressional district in Louisiana was an unconstitutional gerrymander.

That ruling made it easier t challenge race based mapmaking, and opened the door for more redistricting efforts across the country.

But here in Alabama, the situation is unique.

The state remains under a federal court order to not redraw congressional districts until 2030, the year of the next census.

So lawmakers were not in Montgomery to draw new districts, as other states are doing right now.

Instead, Republican are attempting to pass two bills that would set special election dates should the courts allow the state to revert back to previously enacted maps that were subsequently struck down.

Let's take a look at what we're talking about.

On the left is the map originally passed by the legislature in 2023.

It was eventually struck down by a federal court, and that ruling was upheld by the Supreme Court.

On the right is the curren congressional map that was drawn by a special maste appointed by the Federal Court after the state's original map was struck down.

The redraw altered the first and second districts in South Alabama to give the state one more majority.

Minority District Attorney General Steve Marshall and Secretary of State West Allen are asking the court to lift the injunction and allow the originally passed map to go back into effect.

No ruling has come down as of yet.

And this is State Senate districts 25 and 26, in the Montgomery area.

Similar to the congressiona map, a court mandated this map when the one the legislature passed was overturned.

But in light of the Louisiana decision, the state is asking the court to allow the state to revert bac to the original past districts.

Any session dealing with district lines comes with a lot of tension and high drama, but this week may have se a new bar for statehouse drama.

A severe thunderstorm on Wednesday led to a tornado warning and flooding here in the state House.

Here are some photos.

This is a view from up high, where you can see just how much water was surrounding the building.

The state and the parking lo next door have always been prone to flooding during heavy rains, and this one really saw something special.

This is from our loading dock behind our studio, where lots of lawmakers and statehouse staff park.

There were multiple cars totaled by the flooding and the water threatened the building's power and gas supply.

The state House was eventually evacuated, but that didn't stop the special session from proceeding.

That's where we start our legislative coverage.

First, with the state Senate plan.

Jeff Sanders cover the Senate for Capitol Journal and has this story.

The battle over Alabama State Senate district lines was front and center in the Senate, as lawmakers took on the special session in recognition of the recent decision made by the Supreme Court.

We're simply reacting to that and again, providing the the option that should the Atlantic circuit do something different, then we and the voters have the opportunity to vote in the districts that their elected representatives passed.

State Senator Chris Elliott of Josephine sponsored the legislation.

SB1 would return Senate districts 25 and 26 to maps originally approved by lawmakers in 2021, before late federal courts ordered changes that would affect Senator Will Barfoot and District.

So the concern right now, Senator Kirk in District 28, among, not only the voters, but also, as you heard, officials who are responsible for the elections, who are trying to figure out, you know, where are we going to fall with this process?

I'm certainly prepared to run in the new, district, if the courts do not change anything.

And I suspect my colleague is well positioned to run in the new district as well.

If the courts don't change anything.

But this is just an opportunity to.

That changes made by the courts.

But during a public hearing in committee, opponents were strong i their opposition to the measure.

This legislature should not be preemptively restructuring Alabama's election calendar based on hoped for litigation outcomes.

Doing so sends a troubling message that this body continues to view federal court orders it does not like as temporary inconveniences, rather than binding legal directives.

The voters of Montgomery and Elmore have been trying to get to know m and to get to know my Republican opponent for four months now in Montgomery and Elmore.

And we are no discussing whether to tell them that they have to start all over.

Democratic lawmakers including Senate Minority Leader Bobby Singleton, criticized the proposal and questioned why lawmakers are revisiting district line while legal challenges continue.

First of all, we should not be here.

The court has already ruled on what they are going to do in this particular cases.

Now, the state of Alabama just trying to get ahead just because they've been told by the presiden of the United States to go out and do some redistricting.

Alabama does not need to do that.

They are purely a state already and a supermajority.

It is shameful that we're here.

But Senate President Pro Tem Garland Gardner defend Republican efforts and the special session.

And because of race, there' that's not why we're doing this.

The court's three years ago was opposite of what was happening today because the Democrats came after the Partizan not using the courts.

Today Republicans are doing the exact same thing, but now it's because of race that doesn't make sense.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

The bill later moved to the Senate floor, where lawmakers debated it for hour during a Democratic filibuster.

But chaos ensued as severe weather moved into the Montgomery area, prompting an evacuation of the state House as alarms blared.

That's when Republicans quickly moved to pass the bill along party lines.

Before leaving the chamber, 26 hours, seven days, Senate Bill one passes.

Reporting from the statehouse in Montgomery.

I'm Jeff Sanders for Capitol Journal.

Thank you.

Jeff.

The plan to set new elections for congressional districts, should the court allow it, starte in the House of Representatives.

Randy Scott covers the House for Capitol Journal and has this story.

Lawmakers returned to the state House for a special session about two weeks from when they wrapped up the 2026 regular session.

They returned to address possibly redrawing certain congressional districts in Alabama, including Congresswoman Terri Soules, district in the House General Fund Committee.

House members take up House Bill one, sponsore by Representative Chris Pringle.

This bill deal solely with a special election.

That's all it deals with.

If the Federal Court removes their injunction against the state and if they don't change their their ruling against us, this allows us to have a special election.

Using the map, the plan that this legislative body passed in 202 and was signed by the governor.

House Democrats do not think changing districts is needed.

The Supreme Court changed the law.

So now so.

So the agreement that Alabama had to not deal with redistricting until 2030 is no longer relevant.

The Supreme Cour changed the voting rights law.

So we're saying that that's off the record, that the 2030 deal, we can change districts any time that we want to right now.

You're asking me this is pending before the court.

Representative Napoleon Brac says this issue has been handled once before by the nation' high Court, and what the state majority is working on will be counterproductive.

This mechanism that you have in place, go through, would that take awa representation from black people in the state of Alabama?

That makes up 27, almost 30% of the population in the state of Alabama?

We're not doing anything to deny anybody's right or ability to go into the polls and cast their vote fo the candidate of their choosing.

This is also a public hearing.

It's more than just drawing lines on the map.

Our communities are dealing with economic disparity, mass incarceration, lack of access to resources, health care, disengagement, an political process all together.

And if we do, this is going to even make it worse.

So this is personal.

I'm frustrated that although six white governors have come from my county black people in the same county are still politically disenfranchized.

That is a contradiction.

That is a problem, and that's unacceptable.

House Bill one is approve by the General Fund Committee, and what they're trying to say pretty much is a race is unconstitutional.

Bill of the pay.

Now all of a sudden, it can't become law based off of what the United States Supreme Court decides.

It doesn't change that the bill is racist.

The only thing now is that they're just looking for an avenu to bring it up and say that now this racist legislation can be legal.

Eliza Jane Franklin says her voice, her vote and representation matter.

We are still tethered to this manner of thinking, to keep black people ostracized from being able to lift themselves up by their bootstraps and be abl to not only have socio economic viability, but a political voice.

Hous Bill one returns to the House, where it is approved by the lower chamber at the state House.

Randy Scott, Capitol Journal.

Thank you.

Randy.

Alabama's two Democrati members of Congress were present in the state House this week, joining their state colleagues in the fight against the Republican plan to set those new elections.

Congressman Shamari figures could be drawn out of his district if the state is allowed to revert to that 2023 map.

Alex Angle report on how figures and Congresswoman Terri Sewell used their voices in Montgomery this week.

In the week since the Supreme Court dealt a major blow to the Voting Rights Act, Alabama lawmakers have acted quickly.

But the Democrats representing Alabama and Washington have objected to Republican effort to revert to a congressional map that judges foun to be racially discriminatory.

I'm not going back.

Are you going back?

No.

From a rally outside of the state House to testimony during committee hearings, Congresswoman Terri Soul and Congressman Shamari figures voiced their opposition to Alabama's special session this week.

There are seven congressional seats, and we are fighting to keep two of them, where African-Americans can select a candidate of their choice.

We deserve to have representation in Congress, and it's not enough to have some representation or no representation.

We must have fair representation.

During a protest, Sewell and voting rights advocates said they were concerned that using the 2023 map would dilute the power of black voters.

Should the old map be allowed for congressional districts in the state would change and Republicans could gai a seat in Congress from Alabama.

The current second congressional district, which figures represent, would drastically change.

You know, I ran into a gentleman last night and he said, hey, man I hear your job is on the line.

And I told him no.

You know, Shamar figures is going to be okay.

You know, your voice is on the line.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Figures.

Address the Alabama House and Senate committees that oversaw all the special primary bills on Thursday.

What I stand here today as the as the little brother of the state of Alabama, trying to get the big brother to do the right thing.

Sewell, whose district could slightly change two, also attended the committee meetings where she led members of the public speak for her.

We're going to make sur that we have a steady drumbeat saying that fair represents is what we're demanding.

Senator Tommy Tuberville, who is running for governor, also visited the state House this week.

He urged the governor to call the special session shortly after the Supreme Court's Louisiana ruling.

He posted on social media, quote, let's go.

But unless the court takes action, the state's congressional ma will remain the same until 2030, despite the special session.

Reporting in Washington Alex Engle, Capital Journal.

And we've gotten word here at Capitol Journal that Governor Kay Ive has signed those bills into law.

House Bill one, dealing with congressional elections and House and Senate Bill one dealing with state Senate elections.

So those bills are now law.

And we will wait, as always, on the federal courts.

Switching gears now to talk about campaigns.

The May 19th primary election is just ten days away, and candidates are furiously making their cases to the voters right now.

Recent polling of Republica primary voters offers a glimpse into what they are thinking and what we might see on Election Day.

Alabama Daily News and Gra Television commissioned a survey through signal, a nationally recognized polling fir with vast experience in Alabama.

It surveyed 500 likely Republican primary voters on their opinions on candidates and issues, with a margin for error of plus or -4.38%.

Why only Republican voters?

Well, polls are expensive, and most of the competitive statewide races are on the Republican ballot right now.

A general election survey would survey both parties.

Let's take a look at some of those results.

First, voters were asked what issue is most importan to you going into the election?

By far, inflation and the cost of living collectively is the top issue with voters.

28.3% choosing that, 12.6% said conservative values and 11.4% said illega immigration and border security.

Voters were also asked whether they think Alabama is headed in the right direction or off on the wrong track.

69% said they believe the state is heading in the right direction, compared to 21% who said it was on the wrong track.

In the race for governor.

65% said they would vote for Tommy Tuberville if the election was held today.

Just 7% chose Ken Theaters and 3% chose.

Will send to Vassy.

This shows you.

While no major candidates jumped in the race to challenge Tuberville in the Republican primary.

How about the competitive race to replace Tuberville in the U.S.

Senate?

Congressman Barry Moor is leading that contest with 23% saying they'd vote for hi if the election were held today.

Forme Navy Seal Jared Hudson continues his rise in the polls to claim second with 19% in attorney General Stev Marshall was the choice of 14%.

A full 40% of voters remain undecided.

But here's where it gets interesting.

The poll asked those undecided voters if they had to choose a candidate.

Which one would it be?

Barrymore still leads with 36%, but then Jared Hudson and Stev Marshall are tied at 25% each.

So this race remains wide open in the race for lieutenant governor.

Secretary of State West Allen leads with 18%, followed by former GOP Chairman John Wall at 13%, but a full 56% remain undecided in that race.

That's huge.

And in the race for Attorney General Kathryn Roberts then it's climbed into the lead with 2,027% of voter choosing her, compared to 14.4% for George Mitchell and 11% for Pamela Casey.

Almost half of voter remain undecided in that race.

Our poll also asked voters about some recent legislative issues.

You may remember this past session the legislature passed a law expanding the Public Service Commission to seven members elected by a congressional district and creating a new Secretary of Energy position, all for the stated intent o reining in electricity prices.

I asked in genera if they support this proposal.

59% said they approved with the new law, with 10% saying they disapprove.

12% say they neither approve or disapprove, and 19% said they were unsure.

This past session also saw debate about closing Alabama's primary election.

Right now, anyone can vote in either the Republican or Democratic primary.

The only restriction is you can't switch parties and crossover for runoff elections.

The proposal that was considered but did not pass, would require voters to be registered with a party before voting in that party's primary.

Republican voters are split on this idea.

36% sa they support closed primaries, but 38% said they oppose the idea, 14% were ambivalent, and 11% were unsure.

Fascinating numbers with the election right around the corner.

We'll take a quick break and be back with this week's guests.

You can watch past episodes of Capital Journal online anytime at Alabama Public Television's website.

App tv.org.

Click on the online video tab on the main page.

You can also connect with Capital Journal and link to past episodes o Capital Journal's Facebook page.

Since 1997, Alabam Public Television has provided programs, services, and resources to childcare professionals, teachers and parents.

Visit AP tv.org/education to learn more.

Cheaha Mountain, often called Mount Cheaha, is the highest natural point in Alabama at 2407ft above sea level.

It is located in north centra Alabama and Georgia State Park, surrounded by the Talladega National Forest in the foothills of the Appalachian Mountains.

This dramatic landscape gets its name from the creek Indian name for the mountain char, meaning high place.

Welcome back to Capitol Journal.

Joining me now is State Representative Chris Pringle, president pro tem of the Alabam House of Representatives.

Mr.. Pro Tem thanks for coming on the show.

Thank you for having me.

I know it's been a very long week.

Very kind of crazy week, honestly, with the flooding and the tornado and everything else.

And of course, this incredibly high pitched special session, I wanted to start with that.

We've gone through the reporting previously in the show, but give me your perspective on why.

What is the goal?

What was the goal of the special session based on the Louisiana case?

This the two laws we passed.

Put us in position now to to have a way for candidates to sign u and run in the general election.

Should the court lift the injunctions against us under previously passed plans maps.

Okay.

So this i and we've explained this before.

This was not a session on redistrict because a lot of states around the country are doing exactly that.

You all are essentially anticipating a court ruling, reverting back to the maps previously passed.

Exactly.

We are under court.

We're on an injunction not to redraw maps.

So we are asking the court to lift their injunction, reverse their ruling, an allow us to go back to the maps the legislature passed in 2023 or 2021.

Okay.

And we've shown those maps to our viewers.

What if the court does act?

You mentioned the general election because there's a lot of confusion over.

Okay.

Well, will an election be invalidated?

There'll be different districts and all things like that.

What kind of spell out what would happen should you get a favorable ruling from the court and the congressional races?

The first, second, sixth and seventh districts those primaries will be invalid.

There will be anothe special primary election called.

And those districts, the highest vote getter in either party primary will be the party's nominee.

They will be place on the general election ballot, and the voters will go in November and decide who represents those congressional districts in the state Senate, the two Senate districts.

Those primary elections will be invalid, and then it will be up to the parties to decide how they will come up with their nominees for those two state senate districts to be place on the general election ballot.

Okay.

So no runoffs and things like that.

But in terms of timing for the congressional districts would it be up to the governor to call that special election called the special election?

Okay.

So the other obvious question i what if the court doesn't act?

I mean, we're sitting here on Friday and they haven't acted yet, and they kind of went out of their way to allow Louisiana to move forward with redistricting.

So, I mean, it's a it's a pretty, you know, it's a high possibility that the court won't.

What if what if they don't?

You know, if the court doesn't act, then it stays the same.

If the court acts and these these new laws kick in.

Okay.

Well, I think that's important to note, because it's all contingent on exactly whether or not the court acts in both cases.

Right.

Exactly.

And the congressional the court has to take action before any of this occurs.

What' been the talk in the state House about the likelihood of the court?

Because, I guess when all this was kind of getting started last week, it seemed lik everybody was pretty confident that we would hear from the Supreme Court, but we haven't yet.

Is there a concern out there that they may not, give the Alabama a favorable ruling?

You know, the court operates on its own time.

They don't operate on our time at all.

I think our the fastest rulin will come in the state Senate.

What the Fifth Circuit did in Louisiana yesterday, that that legislative case was very similar to the Alabama case.

And they very quickly overturned the lower court's ruling and told them to run under the other districts.

And so we're hoping that the court will look at ours and see the parallels between the two and tell us, go ahead and run the, you know, revert back to the 24 2021 map and run in those two Senate district.

So it could be like a split decision kind of thing.

You know there's just a lot of anger out there.

We're hearing it her in the halls of the state House.

You saw at the gallery today which went nuts.

You're hearing your colleagues a lot of anger from, from their perspectiv saying, look, what you're doing is diluting the black vote diluting black representation.

How do you respond to those kind of arguments?

Yeah.

Well, the the the the people in the gallery, many of those, they were bussed in, there were some locals, but a lot of them were bussed and to be here.

And the members now stood in the well for 4.5 hours and by far th Democrats were very respectful.

They were on point.

They were all message.

They were very well coached.

And they asked questions about the bill.

They asked questions about the case.

And we were very respectful to each other.

There were a few that were here that were looking for a political advantage back home in their elections.

And it you could tell who was just here trying to get political advantage and who was here sincerely trying to get to, an answer.

But does this dilute black representation?

I don't believe it does.

I believe in the end, we're if you go back to the Senate, the Senate map.

I mean, Senator Hatch was made whole, and then Senator Buffet's made whole.

It's the same.

That's what I never coul understand why they took that.

That, Alabama students map but it didn't change anything.

You still had a majority white and majority black district.

They just swamp the districts.

And Congress, you know, we lost a congressional seat to all the court order, and we're trying to we're trying to get it back and but we're not drawing a map.

We think because of the population shifts and the demographic shifts in those two districts, we think with quality candidates, we can win all seven congressional districts at the ballot box and not in the courtroom.

Well, let me ask you about that, because I asked you about your anger from the left.

Right from Democrats.

There's also, I hear I heard on talk radio this morning about anger from the rights and will our show drawing A70 map as a straight up Republican majority map like other states are doing?

Tennessee just did it.

Florida's looking at doing something like that.

It's kind of this arms race of redistricting.

So why aren't why wasn't that part of it?

Can you I mean, I think I get it in terms of the court order, but can you explain to those Republicans who are insisting that you'll actually do draw A70 map, why that's not happening?

We are the only state under a federal injunction from redrawing.

We have an injunction that we have to go back in front of three judges and ask them to lift that injunction.

If we brought a bill into this session drawing A70 map.

I'm not a lawyer, but I promise you I'd be standing in front of those judges with that map saying, read your last opinion on what these guys are like.

They're here to asking you to listen.

Injunction.

And they're going to they want to draw a seven zone map.

And we're afraid those judges would then go and put us under section three preclearance, which what does that mean?

That means, remember section five.

You remember when they did?

I remember the old days of pre-clearance.

Yeah.

Section five preclearance.

They did away with section five because we had to go to the federal government on bended knee and ask permission to do anything dealing with elections, whether it's moving a voting precinct across the street or anything we do.

There's still section three under the Voting Rights Act, and the courts can put us back under sectio three, where any changes we make have to go to Washington and get approval.

So you're saying if if Alabama, if the legislature kind of ignored the court order and said, you know, screw it, we're going to do, you know, seven zero map, then you're saying that that would actually work against your goals o of more Republicans in Congress.

Exactly.

If we ignore that court order and try and draw a map when we go before those judges and ask them to lift that court order, that the opposition is going to come in and say, if you lift it, this is what they're going to do.

And I believe that the judge will then turn around and say, not only are we not going to lift your court order, we're going impose section three, pre-clearance on the state of Alabama.

So we'll be the only state in the nation that has to go to Washington to get, any change in election law.

Well, we're almost out of time, but I have to ask you this.

We've.

I guess this is my, like, fourth or fifth go round of o being around for redistricting.

I really don't love the the issue.

It's fraught with all kinds o problems, all kinds of politics.

But I was thinking about it.

It's been that way forever.

It's been that way since before the Voting Rights Act.

I mean, the drawing of districts is just a complicated political matter.

Kayleigh, the Louisiana decision.

We've been anticipating thi for years in terms of clarity.

Can race be used to draw maps?

They say no, court says no.

There's a lot of fervor right now, and there will be probably for some time.

But will, in your opinion will that ruling eventually lead to more clarity in terms of what the state is allowed to do in terms of drawing its own maps?

We have been begging fo clarity, like every other state, and the courts will not tell us specifically what we can and cannot do.

But, you know, you still have the Voting Rights Act.

You still have problems of cracking and parking.

You still have problems with the jingles test.

They left the jingles test fully intact, you know, and you have problems with vote dilution.

You you can't, you know, retrogression.

So many of the protections are still there.

This is just exactly what happened when they did away with the, you know, section five preclearance.

People went crazy and start screaming.

The Voting Rights Act was been destroyed.

And you're going to hav all these terrible things happen in which the settles down.

People are going to realize they're still going to be able to bring lawsuits.

It's just made it harder.

It puts the burden on the to prove there's discrimination and not the courts.

Just accept prima faci evidence of discrimination based on voting patterns.

And yet again, we ar waiting on the court as usual.

It's Pringle.

Thanks for your time.

Thank you.

Appreciate it.

Hi, mom.

Hey, dad.

Say hello to mom for my watch.

Fair enough.

We'll be right back.

Alabama Public Television is your place for quality educational services.

Free professional development for educators and childcare providers with access to free, curriculum aligned videos, lesson plans and instructional resources with PBS Learning Media and all the PBS kids programs, parents know and trust.

Learn something new every da with Alabama Public Television.

Visit us at AP tv.org/education to learn more.

You're watching Alabama Public Television celebrating 70 years of service to Alabama.

Welcome back to Capital Journal.

Joining me next is state senator Marica Coleman from Pleasant Grove.

Senator, thanks for making the time.

I know it's been a very long week.

It's been a very long way, and I think my eyes are red.

I haven't slept any of this week.

So.

And of course, I feel like we shouldn't have been here in the first place, but I do.

I'm still living in courage with the number of citizens from the state of Alabama who have come to kind of let their voice be heard.

Certainly.

And we saw some of that earlier in the show.

Lots of folks, lots of demonstrations, things like that.

Yeah.

We've you know, by now we know what's happened.

But I wanted to ask you to again spell out if you would, for our viewers, your basic opposition.

Sure.

What the Republicans did this special session.

Sure.

So, we were under court order.

The court had determined that, there had been some discrimination in our redistricting.

And this was for some two state senate seats in additio to the two congressional seats.

So the court drew race neutral lines, made some opportunity districts, both in the state Senate and the congressional lines.

And we were under that order not to do any more, redistricting until 2030.

Well then after the court decision, my Republican colleagues decided, hey, let's go ahead.

In the event that our injunction that we're under is lifted.

And so it's a maybe if this happens kind of case and, they waste the taxpayer dollars again, we had already stipulated the state had stipulated to not do lines again until 2030.

That was what we were ordered to do.

So what they did for this special session, which we contend is a violation of the court order, but in addition to a violation of the state constitution, in 2022, the voters of the state of Alabama overwhelmingly supporte amendment four, which became law that said that there can be no major, laws that impact the outcome of a general election.

You can't do that within six months of a general election.

So my colleagues had until May the 1st to pass a thing, without being in violation.

Well, we didn't come in to session until May the 4th.

So, again, we think we believe that the Republican, party, not the party itself, in support of our represented the, the Republicans in the legislature are pushing an effort to violate the court order, and the state constitution.

So if the listening audience can get all of that, well, there's quite a lot.

Yeah, we've got some time.

So do you expect specifically on the constitutional thing, right.

That that provision because the Republicans say.

No they're fine.

I guess you expect a lawsuit on that.

Oh, absolutely.

Absolutely.

And I read a letter today, on the Senate floor from Attorney General Steve Marshall, that, he sent out in 2024.

And it was about the mora turpitude, law that was passed.

And he was directing everyone at that time.

It was suppose to go into effect October 1st.

And he said, no, we can't do that.

Based on that amendment for the state law.

So they would work to get i implemented after the November 5th, but they could not do it on October the 1st.

And so that, again, was proof that my colleagues also know that they're in violation of state law.

And again, we come here and we have spent taxpayer dollars cost mone to come into a special session.

I talk personally about some of the the health issues that my family is having.

I got a brother UA hospital need to do some things for my mother and my father, but yet I'm here.

What I think is a fake special session.

Because unless the court lifts an injunction, that those those bills won't do anything.

And I have confidence in the court.

Well, let me ask you about tha because, you know this wasn't a redistricting effort around the country.

You're saying states.

Republican and Democrat.

Right.

Bolster their totals in Congress.

This wasn't that exactly.

This was if the court acts right, then we'll be ready to to go back to that.

So does that make a little bit of sense in terms of it's not exactly thumbing their nose at the court.

Oh it's absolutely.

I mean, they know that the court that the, the maps that they want to go back to the 2021 map and the 2023 map.

The court it already said we see that there was, deliberate racial issues with those particular maps themselves.

So and so they drew race neutral maps.

So to divert back to those maps again is thumbing the nose middle finger, however you want to categorize it to those federal judge who I have to make the listening audience know this, that three judge panel, those they were all appointed by Republicans, two Trump appointees and a Reagan appointee.

They came up with that ruling.

So now this Republican legislature said, oh, we don't care about you.

We're we're going to do what we want to do.

Well, let me ask you, this again was not a redistricting effort.

What do you expect when, I don't know, maybe this next session after the quadrennial or in the future for Republican to go for that seven zero map?

There's a lot of folks on the right putting pressure on Republicans to do just that.

Do you expect them to?

Well, number one, it depends on what happens with this injunction.

I, I suspect if that is lifted, they'll do it now.

If it's not 2030.

Absolutely.

And and how do I know that?

Because some of the members and of course, the lieutenant governor have tweeted about it, that, this is a Republican state and they should have the entire delegation.

And that's just not smart.

I'm going to be nice about it and say it's not smart.

You always want to have a mixed delegation.

You want to have voices that represent both sides of that.

Now, of course, independence and other folks who say you need everybody there, but specifically when it come to the congressional delegation, which is one branch of government, the executive branch flips often.

So if we have an entire, Republican delegation in Washington, DC and a Democratic president, that does not bode well for a could not bode well for the citizens of the state of Alabama.

During the Biden administration, we had Congresswoman Soul, member of leadership, direct access to, the white House.

And I'm convinced that is the reason why the state, benefited financially the as much as it did for build back better infrastructure, all of those things, the amount of money that came to the state by having that Democratic congresswoman and now two member that will have a direct access to the white House, just like now, our Republican members of the delegation have a direct access to the white House.

And so when I think about one of the big projects that's going on right now that we just announced, the Coast Guard coming to Jefferson County coming to the state of Alabama, the entire delegation work together to bring that and to lose Congresswoman Soul, who is passing your tea.

That's another issue has since seniorit in the House of Representatives.

And now the expertise of congressman figures with direct knowledge of how the Justice Department works and all that he has to bring we lose that level of expertise.

But on the seniority in when we get a and I mean, I'm a Democrat, so I'm hoping we'll have a Democratic president.

But if a Democratic president is elected, but even if we get a Democratic House, which is why we believe the president is doing what he's doing and encouraging these state to do redistricting and pickups.

Many people think that the House is going to flip if it flips.

Democrat Congresswoman Soul is in leadership.

She already serves on ways and means, on intelligence, having a member and leadership that is money and influence for the state of Alabama.

So that's why I truly believe we ought to have a mixed delegation.

So all voices are heard.

But also we have that direct access to the Washington DC.

Well we only have a little bit of time left, but I wanted to ask just kind of theoretically how should it work.

You know after Kelly did thi the court said okay, no racial Gerrymanders can't use race to draw these maps.

Well, the the courts have been basically asking states to do that for years.

So how should it work?

How should yeah, how can you not use race to draw districts and yet end up with, as you say, a a diverse delegation that has representation?

Well, I think also you really shouldn't have elected officials doing might get in trouble with some of my colleagues, but I believe this you should have an independent entity that is doing redistricting like a commission.

That is the trend because, studies and polls have shown that the majority of Americans do not like gerrymandering.

They don't like it.

They don't think it's fair.

I don't think it was righ when Democrats were in control and they fixed the that the districts to keep political party, power.

Just like I definitely don't like what the Republicans are doing right now in gerrymandering.

So if will work correctly, you would have this independent commission that would trawl these maps, not think about or not have political party as a factor or race.

They'd be race neutral.

And you use other, factors such as communities of interest and other things that we have in common.

That's the way it should work in the America that I want to live in.

And get the, the, the politica parties out of it all together.

But, I just hope that folks are paying attention to what happened here.

Never in my life di I think I would live in a state, where my members, my colleagues would say that my voice doesn't matte or the people that I represent.

Their voice doesn't matter.

I've never told a Republican.

I have disagreed with Republicans.

Just like I've agreed with them.

I can disagree with the, ideological and still believe you deserve representation and still believe that your voice ought to be heard.

The Republicans are saying differently to us.

They shown us now with a think about Democrats, communities of color other marginalized communities.

So the people of the state of Alabama are going to have to say, that's not the direction we want to go in as a state.

It's also bad for economic development.

When you tell certain people they're not welcoming to your state they won't come into your state.

Industry won't come in the state.

The best way that we can recruit is have a diverse, educated society with infrastructure where all of the boats and tide rights together.

So that's the Alabama I want to live in.

That's the country that I want to live in.

Yeah.

Interesting concept of commission.

I'm not sure it would fly in this hyper political environment that we're in right now, but I hear your point.

We're out of time.

Thank you so much for your time.

I know you've had a very long week, but thanks for coming and sharing.

Thank you so much.

We'll be right back.

The Alabama Department of Archive and History was founded in 1901, becoming the nation's first publicly funded independent state archives agency.

The archives identifies, preserves, and makes accessible records and artifacts of enduring historical value to the state.

Thomas owned, founded the agency and served as its first director.

He was succeeded by his wife, Marie Banchero, who headed the archives for 35 years and was the second woman to lead a state agency.

Welcome back to Capitol Journal.

Joining me next is Jay Mitchell, Republican candidate for Alabama attorney general.

Mr.

Mitchell thanks for coming on the show.

Great to be here, Todd.

Thanks for having me.

Well, let me start by asking you the question I ask every candidate, and that is, why are you running for it?

More importantly, why do you want to be attorney general?

Yeah, I think it's very important that we have, in this next season of state government, an attorney general who is really focused on a couple of big things.

Number one, makin sure that we are restoring law and order, establishing public safety in Alabama, especially in our cities.

And that's going to be my number one priority.

And then secondly making sure that we've got an AG who is going to be working closely with President Trump and soon to be Governo Tuberville, to go and get what I call generational conservative victories in our state.

We have a unique opportunity with the president being back in the white House with the agenda setting that' going on at the national level.

With with Coach Tuberville soon to be coming back, coming into the capital and really alignin with that agenda, we need an AG who's fully aligned with that and not just aligned, but really has the right mindset and attitude about it.

We need an AG who's going to be on offense with the president and with Coach Tuberville, and I'm going to be bringing that mentality, that attitude to the office.

Talk about your background.

You obviously were on the Supreme Court elected to the Alabama Supreme Court, stepped down from that role to run for AG which I guess speaks to how much how serious you are about the job.

Talk about your background not just on the court but legally.

And what led you up to this point?

Yeah.

Well, my wif Elizabeth and I will celebrate 25 years of marriage, this summer.

We've got four kids.

Two kids in college, two in high school.

Life is very full at the Mitchell house.

And you're right.

I spent the last six and half years serving as a justice on our state's highest court, the Alabama Supreme Court.

Before that, I spent 16 years in the courtroom.

And, was consistently ranked as one of the top courtroom lawyers in Alabama and in the United States.

I love being on the court.

Loved working with my colleagues.

Loved handling, really the biggest, toughest, most complex criminal and civil cases that we have in Alabama.

But I really I've been having conversations with people the last few years about whether I might be interested in going to run for attorney general in 2026.

As you know, it's a vacant seat in 2026.

And, that's had a strong appeal to me.

As much fun as I've had being a judge.

You know, if you're a judge you need to be above the fray, and you need to just really be handling the cases and the controversies that come before you.

And I spent 16 years in the middle of the fray in a courtroom before judges and juries.

And so, that it was something that I really went and, investigate and really wanted to figure out.

Am I being called to this other opportunity?

And ultimately after a lot of prayer and soul searching and seeking counsel from our pastors, my wife and I determined, yeah, we feel called to this opportunity.

And ultimately, I believ I can make a greater difference, have a greater impact for the people of Alabama.

Being able to be the AG, not just handling cases that come to me, but being able to be the initiator, the catalyst for things going on in our state.

Of course, it was on the Supreme Court where that really controversial IVF decision and mutual fertilization, case that you authored the opinion on and received some criticism for it because ultimately I know you say this wasn't the intent, but ultimately it led to a suspension, a pause of IVF treatments.

A lot of families, you know, descended upon this building, asking them to pass a law, which they eventually did, giving them some relief.

But talk about this ruling.

You've been criticized heavily for.

Is this a case of unintended consequences?

No.

This was the Supreme Court following the law as it existed at that time.

I want to be very clear, Todd.

I support IVF, and I'm in favor of protecting IVF families, which is what that Alabama Supreme Court decision was about.

These were IVF parents who had lost their embryos, in a fertility clinic and sued, for redress.

And so that's what we were doing in that case.

I'll tell you, I'm very thankful for the way President Trump and Senator Barrett have led the conversations on these issues, and I'm looking forward to being the next attorney general and partnering with them in those conversations.

Well, what was it about the ruling specifically because you had colleagues, justice sellers?

Justice could basically say in their, dissents that this was not necessary.

You don't have to go that far.

How do you answer those criticisms?

Well, that was a respectful disagreement about interpretation of law.

I certainly, love and value my former colleague Justice Sellers and Justice Cooke.

They do a great job.

What we also said the majority opinion, however, was, we had to pronounce the law as we found it at that time.

And if there needed to be a change in the law, that was the responsibility of the legislature to come in and do.

And obviously that's what happened.

And that's that's the way it's supposed to work.

We're not the ones in the court system making the laws.

It's up to the legislature t pass the laws and approve them.

Well, thank you for that.

I appreciate that explanation.

You know, you listed off a lot of issues.

Crime is at the top of your list aligning with the feds and the governor and all that which is very important.

I'll get to that in a second.

But what issues maybe we not hear about on the campaign trail.

I mean, I get it, it's the campaign rhetoric.

You're out there with the ads and everything, but what what are some aspects of the attorney general job that maybe you want to focu on, that we don't hear so much about on the campaign trail that aren't necessarily the sexiest of issues.

Well, I'll leave it up to others is a little sexy or not.

I'll tell you what's important to me and what I hear from voters as I travel across the state.

It's really making sure that we're dealing with the problem of violent crime that we are dealing with the problem of illegal immigration, and making sur we're set up at the state level to work seamlessly with Ice and the Trump administration to take illegals off the streets and get them deported, and then really cooperating with the president's agenda, really bringing the MAGA agenda to our state so that we can do some big things.

I'll tell you a few of those things that I'm talking about tha I'm hearing from voters about.

One is making sure that we're not allowing child predators to prey on our kids and our grandkids online.

I've got four kids.

They grew up doing the online gaming thing.

Elizabeth and I did the very best we could to pu filters and guardrails on those.

But there are always workarounds, and a lot of these child predators are always lurking, always looking to do those things.

We've got to make sur there are other Republican AGS across the country who are really in that fight.

And I'll just tell you, that's a fight I'm going to get into, and I'm coming to that fight with the heart of a dad, you know, making sure that we're, Well, look, we're here at the statehouse today.

The governor's called a special sessio on congressional redistricting, and, I think there's a gigantic opportunity here this week for the legislature to approve new maps that will, that will be as conservative as Alabamians are and allow Alabamians to send, more conservative Republicans to Washington, to help President Trump.

And we need energy in this next season of state government.

Who's going to be prepared to defend those maps?

I think it's really important when we're talking about hiring the next attorney general.

We're talking about hiring the next courtroom lawyer, the top courtroom lawyer in the state.

I've got over two decade of experience in the courtroom on both sides of the bench, and I think we've got to have somebody with those that experience those qualifications to come into the role next.

Well, that leads me to my next question because it's been my observation over the last, I don't know, a couple of decades if you will, that the role of Attorney General has really evolved.

I mean if you go back 30 years I think it would.

It's fair to say that there was a lot more focus as the top cop.

Right?

But over the years it's bee that litigation role has played a greater and greater role.

Meaning if there's a Republican in the white House supporting his efforts aligning, if there's a Democrat, you know, going after, you know, litigating various laws and things like that.

So talk about that balance, because, you know, it's going to be both.

There' going to be a litigation role.

There could be a Democrat in the white House next.

And that that shift changes.

So talk about that balance of being the top cop, the top prosecutor, but also the top litigator, especially at the federal level.

Yeah.

Well, I think there are two big areas of focus for me as the next attorney general.

One is really making sure we're focusing on our state.

You know, the way I've run my campaign, the way I've moved around the state for the last ten and a half months, the way I've raised money in this campaign.

I've really, really focused o the state because I want to do I really want to be focused on Alabama and doing the best possible things we can do for Alabama and for Alabamians.

And that's wh I'm so focused on public safety, and making sure we're solving the problem of violent crime.

I want to work closely with Coach Tuberville as he staffs and populates the next administration to make sure we're doing good things, in the agencies, and in the executive branch to make sure we're we're doing all that.

But there's no question there is, litigatio that goes on across the country.

And Republican AGS have to be working alongside each other just depending on the case, depending on the issue, depending on the project, where I want to make sure we're focused is really working closely with the white House and with the president.

You know, President Trump, as far as I'm concerned, he he's the quarterback of the team, the quarterback of the conservative movement, the quarterback of the Republican Party.

And we need to make sure we're working closely with his administration to push back all this obstruction and harassment and intimidatio coming from these blue states.

And at times we're going to need to line up on behalf of President Trump and go to war against some of thes blue states and blue state AGS who are trying to obstruct his agenda.

So I'm going to be working closely with him.

Closely with Coach Tuberville, as we know, is a close ally of the president, to make sure we're blocking and tackling well for the people of Alabama nationally as well.

Football metaphor is all around.

One last question about issues that is gambling.

And I've talked to your opponents about this as well, because it's just a big issue every year.

There's a lot of times confusion about it, but the attorney general does play a role here in terms of how much the office will focus on it.

I mean, with the ability to focus on it.

I'm not talking about legislation.

The legislative next yea could do something I couldn't.

But how do you want to approach the issue of gambling in terms of enforcement as the AG?

Well, Todd I've been clear and unequivocal about this throughout the campaign.

I'm not for gambling.

I'm not for gambling expansion.

That's just that.

That's a matter of principle for me.

I get concerned about seeing casinos go all up and down our state, on our beaches.

I was in Baldwin County last week.

You know, Birmingham's had record levels of crime and homelessness in recent years.

I get concerned about droppin a casino in the middle of that.

So I'm not for gambling or gambling expansion.

That said, the legislature in the next quadrennial may pass a law or may pass a proposed constitutional amendment to put in front of the people of Alabama.

And so the law may change.

And I will say, as our nex attorney general, I'll be duty bound to enforce and apply whatever the law is.

That being said as well.

I'll tell you, we got a lot of illegal gambling going on in Alabama already, and, that that makes me very concerned.

I tell you, if you drive out old 78 and West Jefferson County heading toward Jasper, you see a lot of it out there.

You see some heading on I-65 north.

Other pockets of the state.

I believe that that has to be an enforcement priority.

And I say that, for a couple reasons.

Number one, I don't think gambling is healthy in those communities.

But number two, it's lawlessness.

It's lawlessness.

And we can't tolerate lawlessness.

You know, if you tolerate lawlessness at even a low level, it sends a message to the community that higher forms of lawlessness will be accepted.

That was the whole premise of broken windows theory under Giuliani.

You know, back 30, 40 years ago, there were broken windows.

The community got the message, hey, we can do bigger and bigger things here when it comes to crime.

So we've got to make sur we're cracking down on illegal gamblin and making sure that lawlessness isn't being tolerated in pockets of our state.

Interesting.

Well, look, we're out of time, but I wanted to give you an opportunity to, tell us about your website.

Do you have somewhere where people can go and learn more about you campaign?

Yeah, absolutely.

It's for alabama.com.

And we'r on all the social media sites.

Would love for your viewers to follow along.

Excellent.

Well, thanks again for your time.

Good luck on the campaign trail.

Thanks, doc.

We'll be right back.

Alabama Public Television is your place for quality educational services.

Free professional development for educators and childcare providers with access to free, curriculum aligned videos, lesson plans and instructional resources with PBS Learning Media and all the PBS kids programs, parents know and trust.

Learn something new every da with Alabama Public Television.

Visit us at AP tv.org/education to learn more.

Olympian Jesse Owens dominated the 1936 Olympics with four track and field gold medals in the 100 meter dash, the 200 meter dash, the long jump and the four by 100 meter relay.

The Lawrence County native dominated track and field from a young age while in college at the Big Ten Championships.

Owens set three world records and tied a fourth in less than one hour.

Owens is widely remembered a the nation's greatest Olympian.

You can watch past episodes of Capital Journal online anytime at Alabama Public Television's website.

App tv.org.

Click on the online video tab on the main page.

You can also connect with Capital Journal and link to past episodes on Capital Journal's Facebook page.

And that's our show for this week.

Thanks for watching.

We'll be back next week at the same time with more Capital Journal.

Right here on Alabama Public Television for our Capital Journal team, I'm Todd Stacey.

We'll see you next time.